Wednesday, May 16, 2018

New STRIKE CENTRAL

Tony White asked me to put up this page for Bloomberg commenters to organize their strike. This is a one-week strike of commenters at Bloomberg View (maybe now called Bloomberg Opinion) arising from them putting up a pay wall. It's mostly an experiment to see if anyone other than the commenters here care.

ACTION PLAN FOR JUNE

1. Continue to get new people signed up.
2. Commenting is allowed and encouraged this week. Show that our words enhance the comment threads.
3. Continue to search for and try new sites to continue the unique conversation without the issue of paywalls. See this post.
4. Started the month with about 37 people signed up.

SIGNED UP ALREADY:

Tony White                                                   
mountaintraveler (Traveler)                         
Steeple                                                           
ModeratePoli                                                 
mb                                                                 
Yak Hearder                                                 
Howard Craft
Fish heads
yobubba
Sir Tainley
Keith Fenton
waynerober
bgdg
eyethink2
Epstein's Mother
Covfefe is my slave name
Johnny sunshine
Reaganite88
clandabbg
JC1010

Iseheijiro
LiberalSmallInvestor
Joe Brady
thrashertm
Zack Smith
M. Faizal Rasol
Dean Achison
DCoronata
The Contentious Otter
Justin Woodall
Lew
Joe_Hubris
Craig
Working Class Dog
Popcorn
Luc
Danno


HOW TO SIGN UP

Please sign up by leaving a comment on this page.

Very important: You don't have to register at all to sign up or comment. After writing your comment, follow these directions, as shown below:

1. Scroll down to the comment box and enter your comment there.
2. Click on the toggle by Name/URL.
3. Enter the name you use for Disqus.

Everything else with the comments is self-explanatory.

About the trolls who might feel interested in signing up, you can guess how much shit I'll put up with on my page. Be respectful or begone.

Even More Important

Tony has been the leader but with a huge openness to ideas and help across the board. I'll be updating this page to put important info at the top.

How to Reply to Comments

This site has limited capabilities for handling replies. Basically it's just a straight list of comments. Sorry, but that's what is available. If it's important to cite what you're replying to, name the person and quote their comment.

The BV Commentariate Mission Statement

We the "BV Commentariate" adamantly and vigorously oppose the new Bloomberg paywall. It is detrimental to both Bloomberg and its subscribers. Our strength lies in the promotion of readership for which Bloomberg benefits through greater advertisement exposure. Our unique and diverse group adds life, zest and value to every article. Our Motto is "Tear Down this Wall."

Rules:
1. When "on strike " all members are very, very, strongly urged to withdraw comment activities from Bloomberg Opinion on or View. (It is our major leverage)
2. While commenting during a strike is heavily frowned upon, it will not be grounds for "Dismemberment".
3. Anyone who signed up will only be removed upon their request.
4. Anyone can signup either here or by "in discussion request" to any existing member.
5. Posting during a strike is acceptable for the following:
a. To protest the paywall.
b. To attempt to get a commentator in discussion to join our group.
6. Shills and trolls must renounce their shillish and/or trollish ways before joining.

Points of discussion not yet agreed upon:

- Whether to go for zero fee, to pay one dollar/year will alienate many.
- We aren't freeloaders. No, we are uncompensated contributors who add wit and added dimension and spice to each article.

Test out our new guestbook
Top item on the right side of the page.



Guidelines for Writing the Daily Posting

It makes a great impression that we have a lot of people willing and able to express their reasons for wanting an open Bloomberg View/Opinion. It's a reflection that we're all literate (Yay!) and involved. This is so much a group effort, and getting more so.

Guidelines for the official daily commenter:
1. Comment as early as possible on all articles from The Editors.
2. Comment as early as possible to a few additional articles that are likely to be popular. Don't spam everything.
3. Include the list of supporters/strikers.
4. Invite people to join and give the website.

Thanks everyone. But remember, Tony White is in charge, hahahaha. Do as he says.


REPORT ON WEEK 1 - MAY 7 TO  MAY 13

1. Daily posting, with responsibility shared among those willing to write. Since we're commenters, there are a fair number willing to write.
2. Strike against commenting. Members ideally shouldn't comment except in response to the group's daily post. However, a couple of comments are OK. 
3. Trying to recruit new members. 
4. Starting the strike with about 18 group members.
5. The quality of the comments threads suffered, especially from midweek through the end of the week.

REPORT ON WEEK 2 MAY 14 - MAY 20

1. Daily posting by multiple members as a reminder of the strike and of the value of good commenters.
2. This was a period where people were encouraged to comment as a reminder of the value of our voices.
3. Many commenters are leaving, so the quality of the threads is clearly diminished.
4. Started the week with about 26 people signed up.

REPORT ON WEEK 3 MAY 21 - MAY 27

1. Daily posting by multiple members as a reminder of the strike and of the value of good commenters.Commenters are also were encouraged to comment as a reminder of the value of our voices.
2. Strikers were expressing hope to find a new home for the Commentariate.
3. Started the week with about 34 people signed up.



This was the first daily posting announcing the strike. Kudos to our fearless leader, Tony White:

STRIKE! To the editors of Bloomberg View

We are a group of commenters who highly value the comment threads on Bloomberg View. We [naming ourselves the Commentariat] are announcing to our fellow contributors of Bloomberg View that the names listed below will be protesting the Pay Window policies enacted by Bloomberg Business this past week  on May 3, 2018. We are therefore notifying our fellow writers that we will, sadly, not be participating in this week's discussions. We do this not in selfish promotion, but in the desire to keep all our opinions open and free. As contributors to the success of the opinion pages, we justly feel unfairly treated to be charged for that success. BV is killing the proverbial golden goose. While we understand Bloomberg Business has to have revenue sources, doing so on the backs of the contributors is unjust and unwarranted. Please join us in protesting the paywall which will result in the demise of free and open discussion among all ideologies and incomes.

160 comments:

JC1010 said...

Since I've used up my 10 free views on BV and cannot access the comments section of any article, I'll have to wait until June to make the posting I put up a few days ago for your review on the former strike site.

YAK HEAERDER said...

(Revised 5/16)

For consideration I would like to propose the following as our Mission Statement:

We the "BV Commentariate" adamantly and vigorously oppose the new Bloomberg paywall. It is of detriment to both Bloomberg and its subscribers. Our strength lies in the promotion of readership for which Bloomberg benefits through greater advertisement exposure. Our unique and diverse group of characters (commentators) add life, zest and value to every article. Our Motto is "Take Down this Wall".

Proposed Rules for consideration, (I will number for easy referral) looking for "Yay's" or "Nays" either here on blog site or in discussion in comments when not "on strike"

1. When "on strike " all members are very, very, strongly urged to withdraw comment activities from Bloomberg Opinion on or View. (It is our major leverage)
2. While Commenting during a strike is heavily frowned upon, it will not be grounds for "Dismemberment".
3. Anyone who signed up will only be removed upon their request.
4. Anyone can signup either here or by "in discussion request" to any existing member.
5. posting during a strike is acceptable for the following:
A. To protest the paywall.
B. To attempt to get a commentator in discussion to join our group.


In accordance with above, if acceptable I would propose Cowboybob and Veth be reinstated (were they ?)

Points of discussion for input and feedback:

- Traveler, if ok I added PV to commentariat to more personalize our group to Bloomberg.
- I've had good company with cowboy, he is quite accomplished, to my dismay he's occasionally been unruly to fellow commentators, (I think he was partying too much) but at heart he's a good fellow.
- JC1010, made changes according to suggestion.
- lets go for zero fee, to pay one dollar/year will alienate many.
- Freeloaders ?? No, we are uncompensated contributors who add wit and added dimension and spice to each article.
- I would like for us to add anyone who requests their addition to our group, I hope to not label anyone as anything as shill or troll even if they may meet the definition. The fact that they ask to join gives credibility.

Thanks All, please let's get consensus and let's go get'em !!

Yak Hearder

YAK HEARDER said...

Aaaaaaaaaaah!!!!!!! Redo

(Revised 5/16)

For consideration I would like to propose the following as our Mission Statement:

We the "BV Commentariate" adamantly and vigorously oppose the new Bloomberg paywall. It is of detriment to both Bloomberg and its subscribers. Our strength lies in the promotion of readership for which Bloomberg benefits through greater advertisement exposure. Our unique and diverse group adds life, zest and value to every article. Our Motto is "Take Down this Wall".

Proposed Rules for consideration, (I will number for easy referral) looking for "Yay's" or "Nays" either here on blog site or in discussion in comments when not "on strike"

1. When "on strike " all members are very, very, strongly urged to withdraw comment activities from Bloomberg Opinion on or View. (It is our major leverage)
2. While Commenting during a strike is heavily frowned upon, it will not be grounds for "Dismemberment".
3. Anyone who signed up will only be removed upon their request.
4. Anyone can signup either here or by "in discussion request" to any existing member.
5. posting during a strike is acceptable for the following:
A. To protest the paywall.
B. To attempt to get a commentator in discussion to join our group.


In accordance with above, if acceptable I would propose Cowboybob and Veth be reinstated (were they ?)

Points of discussion for input and feedback:

- Traveler, if ok I added PV to commentariat to more personalize our group to Bloomberg.
- I've had good company with cowboy, he is quite accomplished, to my dismay he's occasionally been unruly to fellow commentators, (I think he was partying too much) but at heart he's a good fellow.
- JC1010, made changes according to suggestion.
- lets go for zero fee, to pay one dollar/year will alienate many.
- Freeloaders ?? No, we are uncompensated contributors who add wit and added dimension and spice to each article.
- I would like for us to add anyone who requests their addition to our group, I hope to not label anyone as anything as shill or troll even if they may meet the definition. The fact that they ask to join gives credibility.

Thanks All, please let's get consensus and let's go get'em !!

Yak Hearder

Fish heads said...

Yak, is hyperbolic smartassedness and caustic sarcasm allowed? If so, we need to reach out to the Otter. And Bleech.

JC1010 said...

YAK, I agree. Yay.
Fish, They could be good additions...to leaven your lack of sarcasm.

Tony White said...

@All regarding shills and trolls:

I don't want those stubborn, refuse-to-listen-to-someone-else's-opinion types [we all know who they are]. In other words, we don't want bots or trolls. Anyone who actually has a pulse and are somewhat warm-blooded can be on the 'A' Team [M.P. is "John Hanibal Smith," 'mb' is "Mr.T," Traveler is "Templeton Peck," and I'm "Howling Mad Murdock."]

-TW

ModeratePoli said...

Comments on the rules. I have a bit of trouble with this, as you guys know, because I don't want shills or trolls, and there are people that I won't add to the list because of that. I've laid out my reasons, and I can do it again. However, if you add my suggested rule 6, I think I'll be satisfied.

6. Shills and trolls must renounce their shillish and/or trollish ways before joining.

That's the big one. And I hope people aren't trying to recruit shills or trolls. So far, it hasn't been much of a problem. But a bit.

I don't think cowboybob should be invited back in. He was never seriously about it. He commented as profwatson last week. This week, as profwatson, he wrote a parody comment about the provost saying 10 articles a month were enough. But, that may not be enough to convince people, so at the end of this message I'll dump my archive of nasty cowboybob comments.

veth is tougher. I'm pretty sure he's a Ukrainian shill, one of two that I'm aware of. (The other is obey-whatever-39wt4wwet5s23423552, who writes all in caps and talks about subhuman ruskies.) To me, these shills don't belong among us honest, hardworking, serious folks. I don't know if shills are scum in their personal lives, but it is scummy that they are propagandists but claim not to be.

I know some people don't want to make judgments about others, and therefore won't label someone as a shill or a troll. But come on! Please don't pretend they don't exist on these forums. And they bring discredit to us if they join, especially the clear shills.

Ok, folks. The rubbish dump (partial) from profwatson/cowboybob:

profwatson: U.S. and the UK are waging a war of genocide on the mothers and children of Yemen.

cowboybob: Trump-Putin-Lieberman(Israel) and the Axis of Evil

cowboybob: No, it [Merkel] is Herr, she is very manly, maybe she is Germany's first transgender head of state?

cowboybob: Germany owes Greece and Italy reparations as everybody knows.

cowboybob: Dennis, the menace, close your mouth, when you open it , it smells like warm steaming feces, because your mouth is close to your brain, that is full of it.

cowboybob: Torah classes for you too,

cowboybob: Jewish people are notorious for saying the most outrageous things. Just look at Harvey Weinstein.

cowboybob: When the Supreme Court is firmly controlled by the Wizard(Steve Bannon) , then you will not recognize the place. Re education camp for you Bob in Kerrville Tx.

cowboybob: Ya mama was a kapo, which means you are a son of a kapo.

cowboybob: you must be referring to Herr Merkel who is at the dance, but nobody wants to dance with the old hag.

cowboybob: Lenny, we need to ban the speech of the Christophobics who say the most hurtful and offensive things. When VP Pence becomes POTUS, that will go into effect.

cowboybob: The Specifically Jewy Perviness of Harvey Weinstein The disgraced film producer is a character straight out of Philip Roth, playing out his revenge fantasies on the Goyim


cowboybob: Ryan will cut aunt Mary's Social Security and Medicare, he is the servant of Satan. Pray for Pence with the Conversion Therapy for cousin Bruce.


cowboybob: Jonny, you really are a counter revolutionary and a fascist in need of re education in upstate NY.


cowboybob: yes, you live in the world of the Shas Chief Rabbi Yosef who said, In an October 2010 sermon, Yosef stated that "The sole purpose of non-Jews is to serve Jews".

ModeratePoli said...

Also, I recommend these small edits:

We the "BV Commentariat" adamantly and vigorously oppose the new Bloomberg paywall. It is detrimental to both Bloomberg and its subscribers. Our strength lies in the promotion of readership by which Bloomberg benefits through greater advertisement exposure. Our unique and diverse group adds life, zest and value to every article. Our Motto is "Tear Down this Wall".

Rationales. If Commentariat is based on 'proletariat,' there shouldn't be the final 'e.' The actual quote is "Tear down this wall." Google it. If people prefer 'Take' that's ok with me.

Tony White said...

@M.P -- regarding "Commentariate"

Nooooooooooooooooo nothing to do with "proletariat"!!! The 'e' at the end not only disassociates with "proletariat," but it gives it a certain cache'! Like it's an exotic foreign-spelled word [think French]. Anyway, I think it was a conversation I had with "Traveler" in the not-to distant past. Ask him. See what he says. {We were both grappling with the term to describe those who do "commentary." He [the other writer] and I tried to find the right term that wouldn't be flagged by the spell-check. Using "commentary" wasn't flagged, so we took out the "y" and added "iate. It didn't make much sense to add "iat" as this was too plain.

Anyhow, that's the long and short of it. Let's see what the others think. I guess you college types need mission statements, admission requirements, and rules so that the social order is restored. I'm open to dropping the "e" on "Commentariate" is everyone thinks it's better [what do I know?]

-TW

Yak Hearder said...

All sounds good. We'll add #6. I'd not seen those cb comments. I like mps changes. I'll hang lose till tommarow in case there is more input. And yes, we need more hyperbolic and caustic sarcasm!

Night all.

Tony White said...

@ALL POSTED MISSION STATEMENT ]thx Yak]

https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2018-05-16/u-s-should-keep-zte-penalty-out-of-china-trade-talks

ModeratePoli said...

@Tony, I love the story about 'Commentariate." I'm sold on the 'e.'

What do you know? Much more about the A Team than I do.

Tony White said...

@ModeratePoli -- "The 'A' Team" was a silly T.V. series that ran in the early 1980s. Mr. 'T' and Mad Dog Murdach were a pretty funny tandem . It always had the same format [make a plan, fail at said plan, make a breakout, re-group, then kick ass and defeat the 'bad guys']. I have fond memories of drinking cheap vodka and watching it when I just started college... no wonder I flunked out after my freshman year [I did eventually finish! Yay!!!].

More information than you probably need to know!

-TW

Tony White said...

Posted list:

https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2018-05-17/venezuela-s-empty-election

-TW

YAK HEARDER said...

OK, I think we've got it, any further input welcome. The door is never closed.



(Revised 5/17) w/95%+ Consensus

The BV Commentariate Mission Statement:

We the "BV Commentariate" adamantly and vigorously oppose the new Bloomberg paywall. It is detrimental to both Bloomberg and its subscribers. Our strength lies in the promotion of readership for which Bloomberg benefits through greater advertisement exposure. Our unique and diverse group adds life, zest and value to every article. Our Motto is "Tear Down this Wall".



Rules:


1. When "on strike " all members are very, very, strongly urged to withdraw comment activities from Bloomberg Opinion on or View. (It is our major leverage)

2. While Commenting during a strike is heavily frowned upon, it will not be grounds for "Dismemberment".

3. Anyone who signed up will only be removed upon their request.

4. Anyone can signup either here or by "in discussion request" to any existing member.

5. posting during a strike is acceptable for the following:

A. To protest the paywall.

B. To attempt to get a commentator in discussion to join our group.

6. Shills and trolls must renounce their shillish and/or trollish ways before joining.

Points of discussion:

- lets go for zero fee, to pay one dollar/year will alienate many.
- Freeloaders ?? No, we are uncompensated contributors who add wit and added dimension and spice to each article.


Thanks All,
let's go get'em !!


Yak Hearder

Anonymous said...

@Yak -- Yakkity yak, don't talk back!

ModeratePoli said...

HEY EVERRRRRYBBBBOOODDDYYYY!!!!!

We need to decide our plan for next week. Is it open comment again, or is it strike (with the exceptions laid out in the rules)?

Please express your preferences! Have at it!

Tony White said...

@M.P.

We're dead -- stick a fork in us!!! They broke us, and they didn't even know it!

-TW

Fish heads said...

C'mon, Tony, we are doing just fine. I just surfed through the comments and BV is frickin pathetic. There is no way in hell they're not noticing. Especially the authors. I left several comments about the overall decline in quantity and quality of the comments just to rub it in a bit. A gun post had about six comments, all lame. A month ago it would have driven 300. Suck it up, keep it up, hang in there.

YAK HEARDER said...

Tony, take a break, it's well deserved. We are only getting our footing for attack. My cooky cutter blades have just been sharpened

Tony White said...

@Fish heads, @Yak-Yak, @ModeratePoli, @ALL

THX, maybe they'll notice. I have, too. It's like a ghost town under the comments. If anything, at least we all have our list of names of the greatest "Commentariate" of ALL TIME!!!

-TW

ModeratePoli said...

@Tony, It's always been a long shot, but Bershidsky mentioned the paywall, so that's good. Plus the best of the commenters rallied around your idea. And they are still rallying. We may not be able to defeat the paywall, but our voices have created a like-minded group of people who care. That's pretty damn good.

Fish heads said...

Comentariat, I've always believed that this is a two to three month project. Clicks and comments will need to show a significant decline for a long enough term to concern advertisers. An increase in clicks kills us. I believe we are doing great. Bear in mind, the BV authors read their comment sections. Human nature. Especially Bernstein, he occasionally responds if you call him out. I'm thinking we address the authors directly with any comments, pointing out that no one reads them anymore. Thoughts?

johnny sunshine said...

Somewhat off topic here, but since no one's in the regular Bloomie comment sections, and no one's really writing in Moderate's regular comment blog either, it belongs here as much as anywhere: Noah Feldman is slumming over at New York Review of Books, this week, writing what might as well be an extra-long Bloomberg column.

http://www.nybooks.com/articles/2018/05/24/crooked-trump-legal-swamp/

Sadly, there's no provision for commenting....

Yak Hearder said...

Yep, Like Fishy says, this will most likely take a couple months at least. If comments are down so is total readership. We just help and point out what they already know. The writers did not put up this paywall and I'll bet they don't like it either. Their upper mucky mucks did this and they're the ones with egg on face. I am sure that some writers even visit this blog to see how much activity takes place off their site. The idea that we have rules and Mission Statement shows them we mean business and I would dare also bet they support us. But we'll have to hang in there before they comment on board about us. Let's just keep on plugging away.

So when is our next strike? And for how long ?

Tony White said...

POSTED STRIKE LIST:

https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2018-05-18/simplify-the-volcker-rule-instead-of-weakening-it

It was my LAST free article so I'll see you guys in 30 days -- Bhaaaaaar haaaaar haaaaaar! I almost sprayed my screen with coffee [I crack myself up!]. Rules are for suckers!!!

-TW

johnny sunshine said...

My 2c - I suspect the comment sections will be pretty much dead whatever we do, late in the month after most people have long since hit their limit and either don't know how to get around it or don't care to bother, so we might as well take credit for it.

I think the best strategy would be to have a different striker post the striker list, without any manifesto, like Tony just did it, just a reminder that we're intentional about it. But if most other strikers have strayed from reading here too maybe it's just us. I'll take Monday if no one who hasn't yet posted volunteers first.

Tony White said...

@Johnny Sunshine --

We'd be honored to have you post Monday, May 21, 2018 [post whatever you want]. Thank you for the backup!

-TW

mb said...

We strikers are doing a great job! It's depressing to stay away and have to do all the work-arounds to access the site, but it really looks like we are having an effect. I have also greatly appreciated seeing everyone's work to get the attention of BB's writers and editors.

I can do a posting of either the strike manifesto or the list on a day or two this coming week. But I need a couple of days lead time as I'm normally a late riser and I live in the Northwest, so I'm 3 hours behind the East Coast.

Thanks everybody!

mb said...

Also, maybe we could also send emails to the two top editors at Bloomberg Opinion? I've done so twice now, so hesitate to do it again in the near future.

The addresses I have for them are:
David Shipley: DavidShipley@bloomberg.net
Timothy O'Brien: tobrien46@bloomberg.net

-- Bea

Traveler said...

Well, I'll be. I didn't notice the original thread had closed, and was wondering why no notifications this past week!

As the guy who came up with the word, I still prefer commentariat, just LIKE proletariat. That is exactly what I was goofing on when I coined the term. But Whatever. I'm easy.

I have seen a few of you out there in the view, but not nearly as many as I would have expected. The comments are a graveyard, with maybe 5-10 comments a day. Except Leonid, who is always good for at least 100 comments. From 5 Russian trollbots. The comments have been so bad that hardly any of us are commenting either! Hard to show them how important we are if we don't show up...

Which inspired me to draft a follow up email to Shipley. A very rough draft, that needs a lot of work:

"Hello again Mr. Shipley,

One week later, and I see our letter doesn’t get the courtesy of a response.

Have you looked at your opinion pages this past week? Everyone has disappeared, not just us strikers. There was nobody there, except for a few Russian bots and MAGA trolls. Along with a few of us speculating on what the heck was happening. Seems like all of the regulars disappeared, not just us. Your whole new raft of opinion writers will be posting opinions without feedback. Was that the intent with this new regime?

Seems to me the obvious conclusion is that BB must not care about comments anymore. Even though they drove a LOT of traffic that has now disappeared. From what was the best site on the net.

Assuming so, I guess we have to call it a day. What a shame. Looks like the strike is permanent."

Now you guys seem more optimistic than me about BB ever going back. I am thinking we should seriously look into that Atlantic disqus community.

Bill

Tony White said...

@Traveler

Wondered what the heck happened to our Sales Manager! Yep, you better get used to the archaic technology -- it's gonna have to work until Bloomberg comes to its senses.

I like that you're commenting to Shipley -- how about using a little sweet instead? You know what they say, A little sugar and spice makes everything nice! Shipley is not going to bite the hand which feeds him. So long as we ain't puttin' dollars in his pocket, he will side with management.

How about a courteous letter to Shipley, instead? Just a sincere note, instead. Try thanking him instead of lambasting him. You get more flies with honey than shit! Please try this and post it. We can pin it to one of next week's "Editors" articles.

Thanks, Traveler!

-Tw

Traveler said...

Hi Tony,

Hope you can see why I called us the commentariat. Primarily tongue in cheek because we add so much, but recognition of reality at the same time. We are just a bunch of proles compared to the Lords of Media upon whose fields we grovel for scraps of integrity. There is a meaning behind the choice of the word. But enough of that.

I think we should email Shipley on a weekly basis. I don't care whether you think groveling is worth it. I don't. We already acted nice and he ignored us. Frankly, the dropoff in folks that are not "on strike" already has me very concerned. You build something up, folks burn out and they don't come back. Ain't nobody to sell to anymore.

Maybe I am just too pessimistic, but I don't see this ending well. For Bloomberg. Or us, if we depend of BB comments to survive. Fishy, you seem optimistic this will persist for months, but I don't see it. If there ain't even enough openings for your wit, you get a death spiral.


So folks, have at it putting together a letter, but frankly, I suggest we present the facts, which is that BB View just ain't even worth it anymore. Already. But maybe clicks dont matter to them, do they?

Sorry if I am so bitter about BB View future. But I take great comfort in the present community, warts and all. So I think we should put together our own site, a la those Atlantic examples.

Thoughts?

Tony White said...

@Traveller

The overall consensus is that it will take time. A month's worth of "clicks" should show BB that paywalls are bad for business. I can dig in and wait it out. I like your admission that "... we grovel for scraps of integrity...." I feel, however, that OUR form of writing will only be increasing in demand. Think about it: not only do we have to present our arguments, but we also have to defend them against shills and the like. The writing we all enjoy is only becoming more in vogue, thanks to the internet. Our skills in writing, analyzing, and debating will become more critically-accepted by the "snobs" who write "old-school" articles without having to defend those words. We all know that our commentary is essential to validating or disputing the public record.

This is our strength in writing we must be proud of it. Think of how many critical writers shrink under the heat with which the internet commentators thrive. Yeah, a lot of the internet is full of idiots who blather on, but our list of distinctive and excellent commentary writers sets us apart. Bloomberg is OUR turf, and I see no reason to pack up and head over to other sites to comment.

You are free to write anywhere you want, obviously. We will keep your name on the list for however long you want it there. Even if it's a freakin' year, we will keep those names on the list to show the world that we are serious and credible writers.

-TW

mb said...

I got a lovely surprise back from David Warsh, who had written a glowing article on his blog (which was linked to by a economist Mark Thoma) about how great it was that Bloomberg was now offering 10 free articles a month. I let him know, as nicely as I could, that the Opinion section used to be free of charge and why so many of us were unhappy about the new policy. His response:

"This is really terrific – the basis for another piece when the opportunity arises, probably in the autumn. I will check with you when I begin.

I have so little time to follow developments, much less poke around in them. But I believe, w3ith Francis Bacon, that truth emerges more readily from error than from confusion. So I am especially grateful when someone sets me straight as thoroughly and pleasantly as you have here.

That Bloomberg operation is a cipher to me. Thanks to you I know a little more now, and a perhaps a little more still when I write you next. Meanwhile, I’ll put you on the bulldog list. You can unsubscribe easily if you like..

david

Tony White said...

FYI -- GO-Getter of the week is...

ModeratePoli for May 14, 2018 posting [" I want to explain why I'm normally a commenter at Bloomberg..."]

https://disqus.com/home/discussion/bloombergview/why_germans_are_getting_fed_up_with_america/#comment-3900185465

20 upvotes, many from outside the group, AND came in as the "Best" comment out of nearly 460 comments! A Grand-slam! Congratulations!!!

-TW

Tony White said...

@'mb' nice work!!!

Persuasive letters need to be persuasive! We need to keep it civil, as 'mb' has shown! We're proud of your accomplishments, 'mb'!!! Please keep the group updated. Thank you,

-TW

Tony White said...

INTERESTING QUOTE -- E-mail from David Warsh via 'mb' :

"But I believe, w3ith Francis Bacon, that truth emerges more readily from error than from confusion."

Sweet words!!! THE TRUTH should be everyone's priority, even if it differs from our own views!

-TW

Anonymous said...

@tony and everyone, Definitely the truth should be everyone's priority. We are fallible, so it is so important to hear other people's viewpoints.

Tony White said...

POSTED to "Editors" May 21, 2018

https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2018-05-21/tuberculosis-how-to-defeat-an-ancient-affliction

-TW

Traveler said...

Been posting a little today, always emphasizing the poor comment quality and enlisting those who still comment. Not a whole lot of luck. But check out this one.
https://disqus.com/home/discussion/bloombergview/all_roads_electric_or_oil_lead_to_china/#comment-3910858699

Nobody but me and the bot!

Traveler said...

Well, we hooked another. Popcorn is joining the strike! Even though he paid in full already. https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2018-05-14/germany-is-getting-fed-up-with-trump-and-america#comment-3911129708

Please add him to the list. Comments malfunctioning again though. So not sure if that is the comment to link.

Popcorn said...

Ok, mountaintraveler got me convinced. Can I join the strike?

Traveler said...

Maybe the messed up comments are BB's way of discouraging comments? :) I sent in a note, so they should be fixed by tomorrow.

Popcorn said...

BTW, Che is gone. The only other pro-Putin commenter on BBG except the ‘beloved’ RW with an IQ above 40. I say let BBG have a death match in Comments: veth vs Yuri. It’s about time for quality dispute at long last;)

Popcorn said...

Ok, I read some MP’s threads. Some impressive research on RUS shills. Who are you? Can’t believe a single person scrutinizing all those comments. You even got exactly the right date of my personal switch from (foolishly) Putin-tolerant stance to ‘independent’ as you prefer to state. For a good reason of course, as can be traced in my comments.

Popcorn said...

Another thing. Bloomberg L.P. derives about 85% of its revenues from the BBG Terminal subscribers. Can’t believe a paywall for BV is of any material significance to Mike Bloomberg. Why in the world they chose to install it all of a sudden is beyond me.

ModeratePoli said...

@Popcorn, it doesn't take a genius to notice the Russian shills. When I'm not fighting them, others are, so I'm not the only one who's noticed. I am only a single person with my own viewpoints, not a shill, not even a government employee. I'm interested in politics, which is one of my main hobbies. I'm in my 50's, so a lot of wisdom has set in. If you want to know more, read my profile and read my writings.

I have a question for you: What caused you to stop supporting Putin and be more independent?

johnny sunshine said...

Posted the usual strike notice to
https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2018-05-21/china-faces-end-of-fast-growth-that-made-it-biggest-economy

Only one other comment there so far.

Tony White said...

@ALL

I've exhausted all I can from the Paywall subject. Anyone else want to come up with some fresh perspective, or insight? There's a new "Editors" article, and probably another on the horizon.

Please someone else?!!!

-TW

mb said...

Posted on the other TB article tonight. Hope I worded it okay.

Popcorn said...

@ModeratePoli

It’s not that I supported him. Never once voted for him in fact. His home policies were always poor (I always said that), but were outweighed by his foreign ones in general. So on balance he seemed bearable to me. Yes, Western MSM are often biased and arrogant when it comes to Russia. Even worse to hear indiscriminate Russia bashing from Western establishment. Putin played this sentiment skillfully by blaming the West for Russia’s home mess (that resulted from his own incompetence of course) via aggressive paid propaganda. It’s very reassuring therefore to see people in power finally starting to distinguish between Putin’s regime and Russians in general (google most recent sanctions-related comments from T. May and H. Nauert for example). This MUST continue.

My personal tipping point was this scandal: The Sex Worker and Putin's Shady Billionaire Buddy Who Could Hold Keys to the Russia Investigation - The Daily Beast

A top official gets caught with his pants down. Resignation follows? You wish. One of Putin’s pocket courts orders any info related to the story be blocked/removed from the web. Roskomnadzor (Putin’s censorship tool) was actually contemplating banning YouTube in Russia altogether as a result. LOL.
Inquiring intelligent minds asking questions about Putin’s public servants were given a plain and short answer: F OFF. Mind your business, serfs. This wasn’t the first time this sequence of events taking place. I say I’ve had it. Enough.
Add to this the (now) disastrous economic (mis)management in Russia that deserves a separate thread for discussion. Let’s just say that I can attest to it by my personal ‘field’ expertise, not some academic theory.
And so, in a nutshell, from 2018 and on the formula is clear to me: anti-Putin=pro-Russian=pro-liberty.

Fish Heads said...

Just posted a strike related comment on a Sunstein article, and surfed through some other articles. Not only is the Disqus display screwed up, the comment section is really quiet. The writers gotta be hating this. Keep it up.

Tony White said...

Fish Heads -- please provide a link so we can 'upvote' the shit out of your excellent commentary! Thank you!!!

-TW

PS -- I saw that the column was VERY narrow, also. I think it discourages posts?!!!

mb said...

I agree, they're trying to discourage comments with those narrow columns.

Clunky but it's what I've been doing cuz I can't stand that tiny window: Go to a newer comment on an article, click on their profile, then click on "View in discussion." You'll get the nice big Disqus window instead.

Or you can begin a comment, post it. Then go to your Disqus profile, click on "View in discussion" and you can then edit it with the wide view on disqus.

Yak Hearder said...

We clearly are hitting a nerve. There's no way the comments are getting squeezed a second time by mistake. Editor in chief is on the hotseat at bloomberg.

Traveler said...

Yup, the last time this happened, I sent in a notification and the web folks got back quickly. Been a day so far and nada. Seems like they are declaring war on their own comments! Bizarre.

Should we email Shipley again? Frankly, making nice don't seem to have much traction to me. How about just calling a spade a spade?

We gotta a great crew here, so all is not lost. We just gotta keep this together.

Tony White said...

@YAK, Traveler

I wonder if we are gaining traction. Maybe Shipley is losing face? The Paywall is destructive for viewership! Perhaps, I will write of my prior experience -- again -- on how the Paywall ruined a great comment section of my local newspaper. You two in particular are great and supportive. We will prevail, with or without BV.

Thank you, Boyz!!!

-TW

Popcorn said...

OK, strike is a good start. But I think we need to answer one crucial question, that’ll help us move on: why would Bloomberg L.P. erect a paywall in the first place?
Sure, every normal company has a mission, that is to increase its value for the benefit of owners. One Michael Bloomberg mostly in this case, who owns 88% as per Wiki. I posted earlier that ~85% of BBG’s revenues come from the Terminal subscribers. ~320K terminals paying ~$22K per annum. That’s over $7B. Some nice dough. Oh, and Terminal users get free access to ALL other BBG products of course (printed magazine edition and our beloved Opinion section).
Now, even if a couple thousand folks choose to subscribe with a yearly fee of over $400... OK, make it 10K folks (fantasy of course) - it’ll still be peanuts in the total amount. Completely irrelevant.
Doesn’t make any economic sense to me. And the question therefore stands. What gives? Why even bother with installing a paywall if it doesn’t have any meaningful impact on your bottom line?
It has to be something else. Any ideas?

Traveler said...

They don't want us? The comment squeeze is just another indication of that.

Folks, I think it's time we start to consider alternatives.

Tony White said...

@Popcorn

Good comments, as always. If something -- anything -- will bring in one more penny of profit, then business says to do it. There is no value placed upon anything these dayz that doesn't have a dollar sign in front of it. There's what's wrong with this country, and the world for that matter. Money should NOT be the driver of all things. Greedy, selfish people have led us to this critical moment in human history. Wealth is NOT everything, but to the weak, it IS everything!!!

-TW

PS - and, no, I ain't proposing a socialist order!

Popcorn said...

@TW
Yeah, I thought about it too. But don’t you think it’d be shooting oneself in the foot? I mean they’ll gain maybe an extra $500K from new subscribers while losing probably double that amount in reduced web traffic. They don’t put ads on their website, but that doesn’t mean advertisers on BBG TV and BBG printed editions don’t follow their web traffic numbers.
It has to be something else methinks. So far nothing but silly conspiracies spring to my mind;)

ModeratePoli said...

@everyone, I agree that Bloomberg seems to be giving us the push. This is fascinating! How many news sites have such dedicated strikers? I started looking into alternatives, with a google search, of course. Found this and this. (Crap, I've forgotten some of my HTML.)

However, I'm not going to give up on BB. I genuinely like their approach to opinion. But the comments were a big part of that.

Tony White said...

@M.P. -- REGARDING NEW BLOGGER SITE

Looks good -- or should I say, "Looks good, Mr. Moderator!"?

-TW

Popcorn said...

Maybe we could address Reuters? Describe the situation. Pitch a few hints on how to organize a quality Comments section and increase web traffic))
Send a cc of the letter to Bloomberg LP of course;)

Tony White said...

@POPCORN re "conspiracy theories"

Hey, you're talking to "Conspiracy Guy"! I have an tin-foil hat in every room in my house! Here's the thing... time will tell. Time always washes out the lies and deceptions, leaving only the facts. I clicked on M.P.'s suggested site for blogging and it looked good! Had some basic features this current one lacks. And it's free, too! I think M.P. is a natural for "Moderator." I ALWAYS have! We're on the right track -- we have our names of some of the best "Commentariat(e)" in the world [well, ok, maybe just the Bloomberg commenters!].

I believe, in time, Bloomberg will see the light. Or maybe they won't. Clicks have to be waaaaay down, anyway. I guess Bloomberg feels they aren't credible unless they can get away with charging like NYT and WSJ. Maybe it's a pride thing, b/c I don't see the financial side of pushing your clicks down.

-TW

Popcorn said...

@TW
Mind you, WSJ, NYT, WaPo etc. have a slightly different business model (WSJ has the largest circulation in the US if I’m correct). It’s all about subscription and advertising for these guys. BBG (like Reuters BTW) boasts a unique feature: its pro Terminal. Their readers’ fees (Reuters doesn’t even have one) and ad revenues are insignificant. It’s for that reason that I see BBG’s fresh paywall as incomprehensible.
It’s late here and I’m almost good to pitch some bourbon conspiracy...))

Yak Hearder said...

If they didn't like comment section in general, they'd already be gone. Giving us "the squeeze" is meant to limit exposure of our opposition to the pay wall. Editor in chief doesn't like getting pointing to his egg on face. NYT's only charges $9.99/mo. for its 2,000,000 subscribers. But NYT's has a captive audience (New York City). Bloombergs logic of following NYT's flops when it attempts to charge 3 1/2 X's without a captive audience. This is a massive fail on the editors part, he knows it and the "Squeeze" proves it.

Traveler said...

Yak, You hit that on the head. So they shoot themselves in the foot to prevent folks from seeing how they shot themselves in the foot? Wonderful tactic that.

Pretty impressive! You, Tony and MP are to be congratulated on making a difference, albeit perhaps not what any of us had expected. Whether we get full comments back is another story. So we keep the strike going just to keep up the pressure. As long as they post articles, we post the first comment so that the limited bandwidth is used by us. And drive away everyone.

Popcorn, enjoy that bourbon!

ModeratePoli said...

I agree. Yak is right. They want to drive us away, but not lose the comment section. Sad that they don't even know what made their comment section good. I'll fucking tell them, but without the f-bomb.

Tony White said...

@Traveller -- re good work

Traveller, you yourself [I had to write it that way!] deserve credit, too. In many ways. I just ain't gonna enumerate b/c that would mean I would be aiding an adversary! Let's just say that we wouldn't be where we are now w/o your help!

-TW

Popcorn said...

Alright, this BBG fugees club is looking good. But mind you, guys, we’ll get bored with our educated consensus soon. Unbelievable, but I’m already starting to miss the crazed putinists and ‘libtard’ bashers (excuse my French). I mean come on, that shot of adrenaline never hurts, does it?))

ModeratePoli said...

By the way, more people are looking than writing. I got 106 hits on this page in the past 24 hours. Versus how many comments? People are looking, and that's good.

Tony White said...

M.P. -- 106 "hits"

Mind you, about 105 of those 106 came from me!!! You're welcome...

-TW

Popcorn said...

@MP
I hope it wasn’t my cats playing with iPad’s Reload buttons;)

ModeratePoli said...

@Popcorn, maybe it was your cat... if Tony is your cat. That would be eerie. That would explain a lot.

Craig said...

I'm following the updates here as well. Not always a big commenter unless I have something to say, but I want to know what the latest is for this group. If we're all getting together on something, I'll be there.

@Popcorn, I know what you mean - I'm craving the dissent that I used to get on BV before the paywall. Maybe I'll trash the local football team in a sports bar to get my fix.

This is what happens when they turn off the supply of the pure stuff - people get a lower quality, more dangerous variety on the streets.

Popcorn said...

@Craig
‘Maybe I'll trash the local football team in a sports bar to get my fix.’
Count me in. I mean forums are meant to be competitive, even if mean at times. I speak for myself, but I’m definitely lacking something...

ModeratePoli said...

Hey, everyone, you know I participate in a bit of name-calling, always well-deserved. I wonder how many people here I've called something or other. Twerp is a current favorite. And of course I like to call out the liars and the shills. Because, duh, they are liars and shills. So you guys can relax a bit if you want. I could get it started by tarring Yak, but he's been so much less annoying lately.

Actually, this could get out of hand. But that's what the delete is for, right?

Popcorn said...

@MP
Ah, MP, with all due respect to your effort in creating this temporary alternative, don’t you think that name- and whatever else calling is a natural prerequisite of any free forum? ‘Delete’ is the easiest thing to do. How about: beat a bad idea with a good idea?
Look, I can say it straightfaced for I was born in the USSR. A place where dissent was often punished with a prison term.

YAK HEARDER said...

Attention ! Attention ! "The Squeeze" has been lifted ! Let's get back out there and give them hell !!!

ModeratePoli said...

Fucking oilman! I haven't missed him.

Tony White said...

@popcorn re prison term

Well goddamnit man! What a great topic for a story -- going to prison b/c of dissent to authority. Thanks for sharing that!

-TW

ModeratePoli said...

@Popcorn, with all due respect, I wouldn't be deleting anything with substance. You needn't worry about that. I love a good argument! However, name-calling and shilling aren't good arguments. Neither are drive-by comments. If we want a good, solid forum, those kinds of comments can't dominate. I have no desire to stifle dissent. There's already too much of that.

Tony White said...

FYI POSTED PROTEST LIST AT "EDITORS"

https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2018-05-22/dodd-frank-changes-show-congress-has-forgotten-financial-crisis

-TW

Popcorn said...

Just posted a comment re our strike:
https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2018-05-23/sberbank-analyst-got-too-close-to-gazprom-s-truth

ModeratePoli said...

I just posted a comment on the strike too HERE.Sad how the threads are bare.

ModeratePoli said...

To everyone, I'm starting to look at a new home (some kind of forum) for The Commentariate. Ease of use and free of charge are the highest priorities. If anyone has experience starting a forum, please respond very soon. Don't let me spin my wheels too much.

Once I've done some research, I'll present my findings to the group and maybe set up a new forum. Participation WILL BE MANDATORY!!!

Just seeing if you're paying attention. Like anyone could enforce that.

Fish heads said...

Tony, I just slammed that stinkingpileofshit that calls himself Shamiracle for that rude response he gave you. I sincerely hope he replies.

ModeratePoli said...

@Fishy, Thanks for the support. I looked a couple places but didn't see your comment. Shamiracle is one of the few people I have blocked. He was so aggravating with his non-stop bigotry that I decided to block him for mental and physical health reasons. I don't need that stupidity, and I haven't regretted the decision.

Tony White said...

@2 replies: @MP, @Fish Heads

ModeratePoli -- can't wait for our new home [I was paying attention]! I hope it's not going to be like my real life when I came home and my parents moved without telling me! I mean, I am invited to the new forum, right?

Fish Heads -- 'atta boy! It made me cry when I read that "rude" response he gave me -- wah! He's just jealous 'cause he's on the outside, looking in! BTW, I saw one of your write-ups had 12 upvotes -- congrats! Between defending my precious honor, and all your upvotes, I'm seeing big things on the horizon [sea surface?] for Fish Heads. Maybe a corner office, pretty secretary, the works! You may have to settle for "GO-Getter" of the week until our dreams of grandeur come true.

-TW

Tony White said...

@MP

Fish heads response [done old-school, no fancy link]:

https://disqus.com/home/discussion/bloombergview/donald_trump_wants_you_to_hate_robert_mueller_too_bloomberg_97/#comment-3913864542

-TW

Luc said...

OK. Count me in for the strike.
Luc

mb said...

My 2 Conspiracy theories:

1) New Editor in Chief Micklethwait used to be Ed in Chief at The Economist. He may be under the delusion that BB is as prestigious as The Economist and/or under pressure to get the BB subscription levels to something similar to them.

2) Maybe the plan is to follow The Economist's strategy. Below is from the Economist Group 2017 Annual Report (note second paragraph):
The underlying financial results reflect declining advertising revenues as global advertising markets, particularly in the US, deteriorated faster than previously anticipated. Both The Economist media businesses and CQ Roll Call were affected by this.
Profits from The Economist’s circulation grew significantly as a result of price increases, effective marketing and the news agenda, which is driving unprecedented demand for The Economist’s high-quality journalism.

--Bea

Fish heads said...

Shamiracle has posted under about six or seven different names in the last year. When everyone blocks him, he changes his name and opens a new account. As a right winger, redneck and fairly shallow commenter, I find him embarrassing and want to kick his ass off team red. I hope he responds. Off topic, but where's Ratiocination? He's gone missing in this whole wall strike, and I haven't seen him comment since they walled us off. Don't necessarily agree with him much but he's a damn bright guy. He needs to join us.

mb said...

Glad to hear you're getting hits on this page, ModeratePoli!

Also, I liked the site you linked to. Sounds like a good possibility.

Tony White said...

@ Fish heads -- agree 100% on that asshole! Shallow is a great description. I'd like to kick his fucking ass too! "Obnoxious" doesn't cover it -- exactly the kind of fuck head the world doesn't need.

Regarding Ratiocination, you're correct on him as well. He was reasonable, and that's all we ask. Try and track him down fishy -- use 'mb' favorites or followers, he's bound to be listed there, since Bea is the Homecoming Queen [everyone's favorite darling!].

-TW

Traveler said...

Folks, give our little blog a check. It is called TalkRadioSucks.com. We are a bunch of ex-FrumForum commenters, who have stuck together for the last 6 years since it went down. There are only about 20 of us actively posting. We might be a little LOC for some of you, so we certainly won't be offended if you demur. However, I do think a lot of you might like it. Check out the Political Discussions for threads like we discussed at BB. DCoronata is a big hit there.

It is behind an ancient spamwall with capcha's that don't work to let you sign up. Given the sheer volume of smapbots, it is closed for now, and the moderator has to let you in manually. My suggestion is to lurk a bit looking at the later posts to see if it floats your boat. If it seems up your alley, let me know here, and I will relay your name(s) to the moderator. (LSI, since you cannot post at BB anymore even if you wanted to, you might as well pipe up there.)

Traveler said...

By the way, when I say LOC, that is relative to the Overton Window today. Most of us are former RINOs, and would be considered somewhat ROC back in the days of Nunn, Baker et al.

I will try to reach out to others not here via disqus. Ratio would be an excellent choice, as would sirwhiskers.

YAK HEARDER said...

Curious, why can't LSI post ?

Traveler said...

I thought we were on strike this week? I have only commented with strike related messages. But I have seen you and MP post, so maybe I got my wires crossed.

Fish Heads said...

Just dropped a bit of smartassedness on Bernstein's Early Returns post.

Popcorn said...

Folks, I spent some more time on Reuters.com today. I suggested it as a joke earlier, but it does look like it could be a great alternative to greedy, careless BBG. They even have an equivalent of Opinion section, called Commentary. Its contents are rather modest compared to BBG’s. And its biggest deficiency is absence of Comments feature of course. Yet. Overall informing quality is of very high standard though IMO. Little wonder too, since Reuters is BBG’s immediate competitor.
Now, if people here aren’t biased against a UK news agency (acquired by a Canadian Thompson corp. in 2008), maybe we could really try to address these guys with a suggestion of starting a Comments section? We can always provide a track record of our commentariat. Which should be especially telling given how pathetic discussions become once quality commenters disappear. Compose a nice solicitation letter to Thomson Reuters. Send a cc to Bloomberg LP of course;)

Danno said...

Count me in for the strike.

ModeratePoli said...

Welcome to Luc yesterday and Danno today. I'll be updating the list soon.

DCoronata said...

As noted, I've joined the strike, in fact it's been nearly two weeks since the last time I've posted at BB and I'm not really missing it that much.
A the same time, I've also cancelled the subscription so not only am I not rewarding them with ad dollars on clicks, I've kicked them in the wallet.

Will they respond favorably? It might give them "good will" with the community, maybe some advertisers will appreciate that they're getting more bang for their bucks without the paywall than with it. I'm seeing paywalls on almost every "serious" website now, from the smaller market local newspapers to the glossy magazines to the national daily newspapers and I think this is the only way many can survive the transition from pay print media to the web. But along with that will be reduced local coverage, reduced reporting and more and more monopolization of the media and news conglomerators - have you seen what's happened to Google News? It went from a nice multipage interface to total garbage.
We need an independent and vital media more than ever, and this isn't the ideal path for liberal democracies worldwide to take.

Tony White said...

@ DCoronata -- thank you!

** "We need an independent and vital media more than ever, and this isn't the ideal path for liberal democracies worldwide to take." **

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

It is truly a privilege to have caring writers like yourself and all the other great commentators on our Protest List. In this world of money before the truth, our "Commentariate" will parse the information presented and reveal the truth. It was truly a sad day at Bloomberg View when the Paywall was initiated. The truth will prevail and lies will fall away like chaff from the grain.

ModeratePoli said...

@EVERYONE, If the group wants to have no comments next week, we have to decide soon and let the rest of the Commentariate know. Please post your preferences and your rationale.

Fish Heads said...

Up to you guys. I'll be out in the Gulf next week abusing speckled trout and mistreating redfish. No internet. No cell service. Copious quantities of IPA.

Tony White said...

@ Fishy,

Everyone needs to "turn off" their technology, and go "old school." It just makes us crazy, anyway. Good for you. We'll be here for you when you get back to the reality of life in the age of the internet. Go enjoy!!!

-TW

YAK HEARDER said...

I'm all for going "on-strike" next week. (It's a holiday and a busy week for me)

Some ideas for consideration;
It appears there may be some confusion as to when we are formally "on strike" or "not on- strike",

how bout, if MP can post in triple size letters at the top of this blog to confirm status;

"X" We are "On-Strike" this week

_ We are "Not On-Strike" this week.

An "X" in front of the message tells what mode we are in.

Second; When we are not on strike we need everybody on our list to (more than normal) comment on BV.
It would be good if they really saw a difference. It's great that we are picking up new members almost daily!

Lastly, lets have a contest on BV to guess when Bloomberg will get a new editor in chief. (Snort)

Thanks !!

ModeratePoli said...

@everyone, Epstein has a parody letter about North Korea here. Not spot on for DJT, but a very fun read.

ModeratePoli said...

I just posted on a column from The Editors. Here.

Tony White said...

Disqus error?

I cannot 'upvote' or approve of the Disqus "terms of use" screen, but I can go into Disqus to view, etc. Does anyone else have this problem?

-TW

Luc said...


@ Tony

Don't have that problem.
Good luck.

Tony White said...

@Luc -- reply

The problem, whatever it was, has been resolved. I couldn't get pass the 'accept our policies' window at Disqus. Thx for you concern. I'll try and locate your comments so I can test my 'upvote' button!

-TW

YAK HEARDER said...

My auto fill quit working for passwords on disqus bloomberg. Anybody else ?

mb said...

I've had to re-log in to Disqus every time I open my browser (Firefox) after quitting.
But no problems at the Seattle Times where I have a subscription and occasionally comment.
The Disqus problem started after they announced their new privacy policies and I "accepted" them.

Luc said...


@ Bea (MB)

Now I understand why I have the dialogue login box turning up whenever I am out of Moscow.
I had the login box 2 weeks ago in Brussels, and now in Surgut and Kogalim (both Siberia).
And yes, it started after i agreed their new privacy policies. My browser is Opera.

@ YAK

Don't have that problem.

@ All

Are we still on strike? See some of us activly participating in BGV discussions.

Popcorn said...

Read a great article on dirty money in The Guardian. It was followed by this text. The British way of addressing a paywall:)

Since you’re here …
… we have a small favour to ask. More people are reading the Guardian than ever but advertising revenues across the media are falling fast. And unlike many news organisations, we haven’t put up a paywall – we want to keep our journalism as open as we can. So you can see why we need to ask for your help. The Guardian’s independent, investigative journalism takes a lot of time, money and hard work to produce. But we do it because we believe our perspective matters – because it might well be your perspective, too.

I appreciate there not being a paywall: it is more democratic for the media to be available for all and not a commodity to be purchased by a few. I’m happy to make a contribution so others with less means still have access to information.
Thomasine, Sweden

Thank you to the many people who have already supported us financially – your contribution is what makes stories like you’ve just read possible. We increasingly need our readers to fund our work so that we can continue holding power to account and producing fearless journalism.

For as little as $1, you can support the Guardian – and it only takes a minute. Thank you.

Here’s the link to the article BTW. Some fascinating read:

https://www.theguardian.com/news/2018/may/25/how-britain-let-russia-hide-its-dirty-money

Popcorn said...

@Luc
‘Are we still on strike? See some of us activly participating in BGV discussions.’
Hey buddy;)
I noticed people from our list partaking in BBG discussions too. I did my best to resist it until yesterday. But that topic on Pu’s credibility was too hot for me to ignore. Guess I’m the strikebreaker now((

Luc said...


@ Popcorn

Greetz buddy)

I replied to one of your comments overthere, but that reply is "awaiting approval" fom BG...((

That being said, the BGV forums are empty. Hilarious to see discussion beteen veth and RW on the Russia related topics.
Seems to me that Bloomberg won't change their policy of the paywall. So the folks overhere defenitly need a new home.

Am in northern Siberia for another week (Surgut and Kogalim). Flying to the island of beauty (Corsica) next week for a month holiday. Should be possible to have a couple of beers together in Moscow in july or august.
Береги себя)

YAK HEARDER said...

Went to Discus blog. Everybody is upset that they have to log in every time now. Hopefully they will fix it. The changes Disqus made were in accordance with some new law on privacy.

Popcorn said...

@Luc
They block some of mine too now and then. E.g. whenever I try to insert even a word in Cyrillic - I get that stupid ‘Detected as spam’ message from Disqus.
Beer+Kamchatka crabs are still waiting. The best treat in hot summer Moscow;)

Popcorn said...

@YH
Probably has to do with this:
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/25/business/media/europe-privacy-gdpr-us.html?rref=collection%2Fsectioncollection%2Fworld

mb said...

@ MP, Tony, YH, all

I like Yak Hearder's idea about having some sort of big X or other signal that we are on strike, since we've all been a bit lax about it this week. I can't believe how hard it is not to voice my opinion! :D

ModeratePoli said...

@Everyone, I'm working on a free forum for us to use. Found a good platform, and now I'm trying to customize it.

Tony White said...

@ "Go-Getter of the week" award!!!!

This is our third time awarding this honor which carries no financial benefit, nor does it get you a job in The White House, but without further adieu...

************ MountainTraveler !!!! ***************************

We need to acknowledge his tireless promotion of the Protest List, and bringing in some heavy hitters, 'LiberalSmallInvestor' and 'DCoronata' to name a few.

Thank you for your efforts, Traveler!!!

-TW

YAK HEARDER said...

General Data Protection Regulation (GDPR) this is the EU regulation that has made a pain of logging on. Disqus did this to comply. What a load.

Tony White said...

@M.P., @ALL re- strike comments --

If anyone feels compelled to "barge in" and speak their peace, then, please, go ahead and do so! We'll go on the honor system here where we will try and follow the "spirit" of the protest.

Let's all please NOT load up ModeratePoli with too much work!!! Please M.P., take it easy with the new site and your work here as well. Go at your own pace, M.P. What's important is growing our list with the reputable commentators at BV.

Thank you, all. I didn't mean to drone on...

-TW

ModeratePoli said...

@Everyone,

Please go to this post to look at options for our own forum with no paywall.

Tony White said...

@MP -- could we start a "guest" list? It would be a way for us to have some prospective contributors' identities to be stored for future membership once everything starts gelling. THX!

-TW

Traveler said...

Tony,

Thanks for the kind words. I enjoy roping in talent. Very pleased to have Popcorn join us. Getting to be quite a good crew. Having Luc as well gives us great Russian representation, which is pretty rare.

As far as other candidates go, I have about 25 I am following, most of whom are already here. But there are a few others I could try to roust up but that depends on where we end up going.

Don't forget that TRS is another viable option for good discussions. Seems like nobody interested though. Surprised at that.

ModeratePoli said...

@Tony, I'll look into a guest list.

@EVERYONE,

Please go to this discussion and make your voices heard! We need to plan our future course.

ModeratePoli said...

@Tony, The guestbook is ready. Please be the first to sign up. You lead, others will follow.

ModeratePoli said...

Wow, Bloomberg Opinion had a great lineup of articles today. Missile defense - important. Manufacturing - important. Dem strategy - important. Haven't even gotten to the Starbucks yet. Maybe that's a loser.

ModeratePoli said...

@Everyone, Sorry to bother everyone again. Is anyone else not getting access to the comments? They are grayed out and I can't select anything, even after resetting my browsing history and getting 10 more articles.

mb said...

MP - it started for me at about an hour ago. Even just viewing the comments is grayed out. I'm going to go log in under a new profile from my ipad to see if it's Disqus or if it's just me.

mm said...

Checked a number of Disqus sites: Raw Story, Washington Monthly, My Northwest. All Disqus commenting sections greyed out.

I don't think the "greying" issue is a strikers problem. It appears to be a Disqus issue.

Evidence: On the Disqus "News Views" channel under the Roseanne Barr article, I found the following comments from moderators:
HEARTS (mod): "Hey Rachel, notice that Disqus is greyed out? I happened to have this tab still open and can comment. However, you can only comment through the mod panel or your notification. How were you able to make a comment here?
RACHEL (mod): Yes, I've been commenting -- did you reboot per @dougt post? Do you think that's it?
HEARTS (mod): Nah, I think it's a Disqus thing.



mb said...

Oops, my fingers are stiff today-- the above comment is from MB.
--MB (Bea)

ModeratePoli said...

@MB, thanks for the investigative work and the info.

Craig said...

I think the greying out, logging out, and squeezing issues we've had with disqus on bloomberg view are all technical issues related to disqus and not to the bloomberg paywall or bloomberg site.
In my time with disqus, I've seen a number of pretty serious bugs that frequently seem to take a long time to fix. I would guess several of the recent ones are due to hasty changes made to accommodate GDPR (the new european data privacy rules). I'm not sure if it's beneficial or detrimental to our movement that the platform we're concerned about being behind a paywall is also frequently unusable of late.

I'm thinking the biggest indicator to bloomberg that they're screwing the pooch here is the undoubtedly steep drop in viewership since the paywall was put into place. Here's hoping that, plus writer's concerns, plus our comments are enough to sway them from a self-congratulatory back-patting stay-the-course mentality.

mb said...

I'm off for a couple of months. Will look for you when I get back.
-Bea

Traveler said...

Bea, Enjoy your travels! Must be great when life is so much more interesting than commenting here. :)

Fish Heads said...

I've been gone all week with no phone, internet, etc. Are we commenting or still striking? I just dropped a smartass comment on the editors post about migrant farm workers. Saw that the Yak had a comment on there as well.

DCoronata said...

Posted a comment on The Rolling Stone Magazine website, was attacked by someone who had some knowledge of the BB strike.

It seems some BB users (not the strikers) are "striking out".

JC1010 said...

DCoronata What's their problem? Are they upset because we're not paying the BB fee?

ModeratePoli said...

Michael Bloomberg wrote an opinion piece. It's a good place to write back to him--something he might care about and personally check. If you want, please upvote my comment: https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2018-05-31/michael-bloomberg-education-for-college-and-career-readiness#comment-3926836889

DCoronata said...

Would have been nice if Yak had spelled his name right!

JC1010 - I recognize the miscreant, it's Jojodancer. I wouldn't be surprised if he is trolling us and maybe its because trolls need responses to survive.

Or he could be working for Bloomberg's subscriptions department!

At any rate, just looking at how the trolls have taken over I'm beginning to think BB is not worth the effort any more, and a new "home" for this group is a better idea.

JC1010 said...

DCoronata I vote for number one and number two. I've had Jojo blocked for a long time. The only good Jojo is the one by Bozz Skaggs. I wonder how the trolls manage to afford the $35 or $40 per month fee. Maybe abandoning BB is the way to go. The number and stupidity of the trolls has been overwhelming.

DCoronata said...

Great song, but I really love Lido Shuffle.

Get the ER doctors to call it, BB is dead.

Traveler said...

Well folks, until MP and Tony put together a new home, feel free to join DCoronata and me at TRS. Just let me know who wants in, and I will let the mod know.

Craig said...

@Traveler, I'm still waiting on posting privileges from the mods on TRS.

Traveler said...

Craig, the mod is opening it up now, so log on and join the claque.

bgdg said...

I've been away hiking in the mountains and the like, and noticed that nobody has posted here for quite a while. Kind of curious where everybody has gone. Personally, I've asked to be added to TRS (waiting for approval) and it looks like I blundered into a space that is a bit of a conservative echo chamber (kind of fun, I get reactions to every note I send). I saw a few familiar names on TRS, but otherwise don't see too much of the BB gang.

Traveler said...

Yeah, it has been too quiet by half. Strike seems over from what I gather. A lot of us are back at BB and commenting away. But there are a still a LOT of notable exceptions. Real shame to miss many of you listed here.

bdbg, I will let the TRS mod know you want in, so try back this afternoon. Funny that you think its a conservative echo chamber (which it is), but we are mostly ex-conservative left of center RINOs. Shows how far the Overton window has shifted. Craig and DCoronata are having fun there. LSI, MP, are you listening? Gents, please check out TRS for some reasoned discussion, albeit placid.

Traveler said...

The mod just got back to me. He says you might not understand how to register, since he doesn't have you in the system for him to grant you permission. Give it another try. Should work.

bgdg said...

Got my registration done yesterday, although I haven't heard yet. Might have to give Charles a nudge. Looks like new registrations are infrequent now, so Charles may not get around to them quickly.

Regarding the site, I was referring to another site which is a conservative echo chamber. Somehow or other I started getting stuff from "Dead in PA" and a couple of other contributors, and since I wasn't doing Bloomberg I figured I'd fire away. TRS does not appear to be an obvious echo chamber from the notes I've looked at. And I would say that the quality of the notes I've seen there is better than BB.

Traveler said...

Thanks for the endorsement. The mod knows you are registered.

Traveler said...

Mod says bdbg still not showing. And is his name public?